How to get your CUIT – the long way round

Papers to get my CUIT by blmurch

The Argentine Tax Office – AFIP (Administracíon Federal de Ingresos Públicos) – has three different ID numbers that it hands out. There’s the CDI (Clave de Identificación), the CUIL (Clave Única de Identificación Laboral) and the CUIT (Clave Única de Identificación Tributaria). The CDI is used for identification purposes only. The CUIL is used for when you are an employee and the CUIT is when you are self-employed or a contractor. Back in April 2008, Kragen and I went to our tax office (Agencia #41) near our former residence in Coghlan and got our CDIs to get the whole process started. In order to do this we needed originals and photocopies of the following documents:
1 – passport
2 – rental contract (or certificado de domicilio from the police)
3 – utility bill in our name

In 2009 I started getting paying gigs my photography work and I needed to be able to issue facturas. In order to do this I had to get my CUIT number. I already had my CUIL number which we got from the ANSES office (Administracíon Nacional de la Seguridad Social), but it’s no good for what I needed.

I knew that I needed the following documents (originals and photocopies) to get my CUIT number:
1 – passport
2 – residency papers from migraciones
3 – certificado de domicilio from the police (or rental contract)
4 – utility bill in my name

As we had moved from Coghlan to Once, I went to our tax office a block away from our apartment (Agencia #8). They were mostly closed because of the Swine Flu and only seeing urgent cases. I told them that I needed to get my CUIT. They told me to come back the following week. I came back even though the Gripe A scare was still in full swing. I noticed the alcohol gel dispensers glued to the walls as I waited in line for about 30 minutes to reach the desk to make my application. Ahhhh – but I had moved and the old agency still “owns” my data. I had to go back to our old neighborhood and change my address on file with them. This is not necessarily something you think about doing when you move, but I guess it should be added to the list of things to stress about during a move.

I went out to Agency #41 with my documents and my old CDI paperwork. They took my papers and quickly issued me a new CDI with the appropriate address and told me to go back to Agency #8 to get my CUIT.

I went back to Agency #8 with my papers and photocopies and filled out forms. As an aside, If you print out your own Form 183F to be efficient, be sure to have it printed out on one piece of paper (front and back). Having two sheets of paper is a no-no since you sign on the back confirming the information on the front. I handed in all my paperwork to the same guy who had seen me before and he gave me a brand-spanking new CUIT number! At the same time he gave me a Clave Fiscal YAY! Now, all I had to do was to fill out some information online using both my CUIT and my Clave Fiscal and I’d be good to go. This means I had to use AFIP’s website. ::shudder::

There are three AFIP offices within five blocks of our apartment. What I didn’t know is that one of them is just for customer service. It’s located at Av. Rivadavia 2690 It’s hours are from 9 am to 4 pm. Don’t get there at 3:55 however, as they shut the door in your face and tell you to come back the next day. When I was finally able to talk with the woman at the front help desk I told her that I needed to register (”inscribir”) myself as a Monotributo with my CUIT number and my Clave Fiscal. She asked me which I was using my CUIT or my CUIL. I told her my CUIT, but that I also have a CUIL. She looked confused. Not something you want from the help desk person. I showed her my two distinct numbers. She shook her head. Again, not something you want. She helpfully told me that they are supposed to be the same number. I had to go back to Agency #8 and have them “reunificar” my numbers before I could register myself on the website. In the mean time she handed me a printout of detailed instructions with screen-shots of the steps I needed to follow in order to register myself as a Monotributo with the Tax Office.

I went back to Agency 8. I got to see the same man again and told him about my CUIL and my CUIT “problema”. He rolled his eyes. He said he didn’t know I already had a CUIL. I said, I didn’t know that he needed to know that and he didn’t ask me if I had one. He helpfully de-activated my old CUIL number and made my CUIT number the number for both my CUIT and my CUIL. Now, I was ready to go and inscribe myself as a Monotributo on the website. Don’t try this site on a Mac using Firefox or Safari. It doesn’t work. You have to use Windows and allow pop-ups. Not sure I want to particularly think about the security implications of the TAX office only using windows, but not much I can do about that. Since I don’t have access to Windows at home (just Mac and Linux here) I went to a Locutorio around the corner and finally inscribed myself! VICTORY.

I proudly went to the Imprenta (printer for bills and such) down the street with my CUIT and said I need some facturas please. He asked me about Ingresos Brutos. I sighed and shook my head. He said that the CUIT was only for national taxes, but that Ingresos Brutos is for the city of Buenos Aires. I had to go to the Rentas office and get another number.

I went to the office on Suipacha and Viamonte and went to the information booth. They said I had to go to one desk to get the forms and then go down the hallway and make a right and get my Clave Ciudad. I got the forms from a very helpful woman who was fascinated that I was from another country and going through this whole process. She gave me two forms for the “solicitud de inscripción”. I went back down and followed the directions to arrive at the area where I needed to get my Clave Ciudad. As I am a “persona fisica” and not a “persona juridica” I got the blue tickets. Almost everyone else there got the red ones. I waited for about 45 minutes (lamenting my lack of a book or an outlet for my dead laptop) and finally was called to the counter. I handed in my paperwork (originals and photocopies)
1 – passport
2 – residency papers from migraciones
3 – constancia A of my CUIT from AFIP
4 – certificado de domicilio from the police (or rental contract)
5 – utility bill in my name

I walked out with my Ingresos Brutos number and form. I made it home and went to the Imprenta’s office and handed over my paperwork. My facturas should be ready next week. Now, I just need enough work to justify the monthly tax-payments I’ll be making. Any one want to pay me to take their photo???

Applying for our Argentine work visas

 
Migraciones by blmurch

Kragen and I turned in our application for temporary residency in December 2008. We started gathering all of the required documentation together in 2007. In December, 2008, we received “residencia temporaria precaria” which is valid for 90 days while our trámite is in progress. In March 2009 we went back to migraciones to see if the trámite was finished. It was not. So, we paid ten pesos each and received another 90 days of extension. During this last 90 day period we received two letters from migraciones which were a bit frightening.

The first letter asked to see the original copy of my birth certificate within ten business days. I freaked. I had turned in my birth certificate – along with Kragen’s – and other official documents with our original application in December. As far as I knew, immigration office had lost them and was now asking for them again which meant more delays, while I got a new copy of my birth certificate from Marin County, got someone in the Bay Area to Apostille it and then send it to us here in Buenos Aires to have it officially translated and certified by the Colegio de Traductores all over again, which would have been impossible to complete by migraciones’s deadline. I tried not to stress over the weekend, but I couldn’t help it. I berated myself for not making certified copies of all the documents that we had turned in, which is always a good idea. I am an administrator – this is what I do – I should have known better.

The next week I met with our immigration lawyer to ask him what I should do. He explained that migraciones didn’t have the originals, that they never hold on to them. I tried to remain calm. He then said he had them. I again, tried to remain calm. He said he was keeping them all so that when we make our application for our Documento Nacional de Identidad (DNI) we would be ready to go. This was an important bit of information that he had just neglected to inform us. I calmly took the original documents and left.

When I went to migraciones with my original birth certificate as they requested I saw why they needed it. Whoever had made a photocopy of my translated, apostilled, birth certificate had failed to make a photocopy of the actual certificate. They had all the supporting documentation, but not the certificate itself. I handed them the photocopy that I had made and they compared it to the original and took it and gave me a letter saying that I had given them what they asked for within their deadline. I walked out of there feeling a bit better about their bureaucracy. They hadn’t actually lost the important document, just failed to copy it correctly. Whew.

In April we received a second letter asking Kragen for the “último ejercicio contable”. We again contacted our lawyer, this time to see what the heck this was. He informed us that it is the company’s annual financial report from 2008. We contacted our accountant and told them to get to it! We had twenty business days to comply with their request, otherwise all of our efforts would be in vain. We didn’t hear back from our accountant for a while. I pestered them again, Kragen met with them, and finally we got the documents – which were pretty bare as we hadn’t done much business at all in 2008. This had to be signed by the president of our company, Luciano, and then certified by the Consejo Profesional de Ciencias Economicas de la Cuidad Autonomia de Buenos Aires. Kragen took care of these requirements and then went to migraciones with one day to spare. He handed in a photocopy and got a letter saying that he’d done what they’d asked by their deadline. Again – whew!

This week, Kragen and I went to migraciones as our “residencia temporaria precaria” expires on June 15. One thing we have learned is to not wait until the last minute with these types of requests as there is always something that goes wrong when we do. For example, June 15th is flag day and a national holiday and last year the office was closed. So, we took the bus to Retiro and walked to migraciones to building five. They took our documents and after a wait they told us that our trámite has finished!! BUT, it lacks the final signature, so, we get another 90 day extension. However, we should get the signature within 30 days or so. We will go back in July to see if we get our one-year work visa: residencia temporaria. This has been a long time coming and I’m trying to not count our chickens before they’re hatched, but it’s looking good! One thing I have learned about the bureaucratic maze of Argentina is to not think you’re done until you are really out. Being close doesn’t cut it. So, keep your fingers crossed and we’ll hopefully update with good news soon.

A year later

Kragen Signing by: blmurch

In April 2008, I wrote a blog post about our beginning steps to creating our business, Distributed Expertise. It has been a long time coming to wade through the bureaucratic maze of Argentine tax offices, bank accounts and immigration offices. We are not completely done yet, but we are officially employees of our company and received our first paychecks! It has been quite a struggle, a lot of learning and a large serving of patience. Business is done very differently here in Argentina and I have to come to grips with that and not expect my normal routines to work. We came to Argentina to learn a new language and get a clue about life outside of the United States of America. I am certainly getting a clue-by-four as to how people cope and often, don’t cope, with the bureaucratic webs and catch-22s that you have to go through.

One thing I have learned is that trust is not something that is given automatically. You have to earn that. You have to prove yourself, sometimes over and over and over.

Another thing is that, at least with many of the people we work with here, email is not the preferred method of communication. Personal relationships are important and the small talk that can be made either in person or on the phone take precedence over the impersonal efficiency of email.

There is a word in Castellano that does not exist in English: trámite. This means that you have an application in the bureaucratic process. For example, our residency request is still in trámite with the immigration office. We’re not done yet, and we handed our paperwork in in December, 2008.

Patience is needed here. As many people can attest, efficiency is not common here. It seems like in the past year some systems have been put in place that will make things run faster and smoother. Some appointments can be made online, but for many others you have to go to the office and pull your number and wait, sometimes for hours. I am learning the very important 3-Ps – patience, persistence and persuasion. This is how things work.